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Crafting System, Initial thoughts

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Raddo

Hi guys! Raddo the bard here!

Just giving you my thoughts on the crafting system, it's current state and how it can be improved. As a disclaimer so I don't get a ball of lightning in the face next time I log in, this is all just meant to be constructive, not insulting. Now in no particular order:

  • The Supplyorder system is nice... in theory. It's good to know I can go to a place and specialize in crafting without too much adventuring. It adds an RP element for people who may just want to be traders or smiths. The problem lies in how sluggish the system currently is, but being able to get real advancement and money without begging the playerbase to help you get there is amazing.
  • The initial problem lies in the speed. It's inconsistent in how it works. It doesn't seem to give discernible notifications as to how it wants to be skilled. If it's a probability chance, it's wau too low, and if it's a consistent xp, it's way too high! This can make craft grinding intolerable as sitting there for at least 3-4 minutes (and that's where everything is still centralized), only to find out you're getting no progress. If its supposed be slow, then let it be slow, but make sure if I'm going to sit there and work on one skill for an hour I know that there was something gained and I just didn't lose a roll of the loaded dice.
  • On the subject of skillups, it'd also be nice to know that if I'm custom making items (not supply order) which tend to cost a lot more and gives no reputation or experience points, that I have a higher chance to skill up. If there can be a few persistent merchants. then that will make crafting all the better, as people can know they will get good xp to make items they can either sell directly to a player or at least get a decent price at a merchant, knowing it could go to someone else when they are not around.
  • Not to be presumptuous, since I know this is an early build, but it'd also be cool to see supplyorder quests specfic to a city/region. Forest areas would be prime for skills needed for hunting/woodworking, and mountains and blah blah blah. This one is just being thrown out there.
  • The payouts are unfair as they stand at the moment. I don't want to go to deep into this and suddenly find someone trying to macro/bot it, but some quests pay out much better than others. This can create a disparity both in how the quests are done and the types of crafters. Why would I want to do that one beyond the basics when this one makes me much more? Adding onto that for a later build, making the supplies further from the orderer or some better quests requiring to go out and harvest the materials instead of being bought could really kick in players needing players.
  • If skill gains are so slow because of fear of powerlevelers or people just buying their way into masterhood, I would suggest an xp or skill limit per day, or even make the xp gained crafting a different form of xp, and like your adventurer levels, you can level up your chosen craft. This does kind of fine tune certain skills, but could leave a disparity in certain crafts.
  • Finally, as a personal request, make crafting wands/staves (or at least recharging them) more craft than adventurer based. PERSONAL OPINION INCOMING: Mages always tend to have it better in endgame, in D&D, Pathfinder, other MUDs, unless they are being lazy, they pretty much don't have to worry about one on one fights. Don't let them corner the market on needed things as well! I was so sad to see my wand of deathly heroism run out and not knowing any way to get it recharged. My suggestion: power shards. Can use them to recharge certain wands or create others, can go by level and even be limited in how they are used to not give a powerleveling edge. I know it's hard to change that idea, but wands and staves can be such a boon at all levels, we need to keep them more alive!

Well, thanks for hearing my opinions! I'm sure you'll agree they are all correct and you will soon praise Raddo the Bookbinder!

6 replies

Raddo

Also, I just wanted to add something, but I had to drive. I'm not sure how it is now, but naming conventions should be widespread. I can understand the need for the material name, but hopefully for a body piece I could use vest, shirt, overcoat, jacket, etc. This is just flavor for flavor's sake, of course, but why not add more to RP? See, ended with a loaded question, now you HAVE to do it.

mosheh

Bump, I'd like to get further recommendations for the crafting system, espeically outright buggy aspects that need to be fine tuned

kordon

Reply: Well I just noticed this topic thanks to Zusuk's bump, as far as what Raddo said, I don't really see a huge problem with the crafting system. The only thing I would definitely like to see are help files for each of the various crafting skills. I think giving a couple examples of what you have to do to get exp and raise specific skills can go a long way to helping new people understand how it works.

Exp: One thing that I do agree with that Raddo said is that for crafting in general, the skill(s) that get the exp should relate to the item that's being made. I understand that the supply order part of it was to be random and if so that would be fine.

Costs: Most of the custom items you can make by buying molds will sell to npc, you just have to find ones that you know have unlimited cash to be able to buy them, not all of them do, plus having a high charisma and training in the appraise skill will help you get mats cheaper and higher price for stuff you sell. *any gear you are wearing with charisma effects will affect this*

Supply Order tips:
The exp and gold you get from doing supply orders is tied to your char level, so I suggest waiting till at least level 5 before you start working on this as a "career".
Each supply order you get is random, and as you will see after doing it, some of the items requested will have lower material costs. You can also quit and get a new supply order anytime you want, so by picking and choosing the ones that give you the lowest cost, you can maximize the profits you get. After getting a new supply order, in the score screen it will tell you the type of material you need to complete the order. The cheapest of these from the npc are planks of wood, copper portions, and iron bars. These are the cheapest ones to get and by picking and choosing, you can accept supply orders to sell for a profit.
There are also areas in the world where you can harvest the materials you need without having to pay for any materials at all. Of this will take time, persistence, and a lot of travelling to find the harvests, but from a purely monetary point of view, it will benefit you. Plus by doing harvesting, you will also gain exp in your craft gathering skills.

Long-term: What I would like to see and get more information on how to do it is, being able to make custom items that have bonuses and perks that players would actually want to use and would pay good money for.
I envision it to be that certain bonuses and styles would require much higher levels in specific crafting skills that your "weekend crafter" would not be reaching for a very long time.
Plus combining different types of crystals and adding them to the recipe, as well as exotic materials, would make for a very sought-after and rich crafter.

kordon

Another thought in response to Raddo's comment about speed. I came from a mud that I played for a very long time. Speed at which you got levels just by doing crafting was around 50-60 hours of active playing which at that time I was doing in about a week. Granted the char exp you get by crafting on here is pretty low, but here you have actual crafting skills that you level. In perspective, here it's a lot easier to get char exp by doing combat, in any class, than it was from the mud I used to play. For a fighting-type class, it would take you about 2 days to gain a level, almost 3 by the time you got to the upper levels, so for me, this is totally different and a lot faster than what I was accustomed to. There were 2 classes on that mud whose main exp was from crafting alone. Neither one of those classes could get much exp by doing combat, so had to rely totally on crafting to be able to gain levels at all.

kordon

Okay, after extensive testing, here are the types of materials needed for the supply order quests: leather, bronze, steel, *iron, burlap, cotton, hemp, wool, satin, *wood, *copper

* are the cheapest 3 materials to start with and easiest to make a profit using

As noted in above post, the price you get for the supply order is dependent on your char level, so even at level 1, with a lot of perseverance you can turn a profit if you just stick to wood or copper items. This will also depend on your charisma/appraise levels as well. Higher levels will give you more of a cash reward, so that makes it easier to profit plus higher levels give you more exp as well.

kordon

As an added thought to those new crafters out there, something else that's good to know. You get gold and xp for each supply order you do, the amount you get will be 170*level in gold and 140*level in xp. That's why I mentioned above that you should wait at least a few hevels before starting this so you will make sure that you can at least turn a profit or be able to keep going it without running out of gold. I'm still plugging away at this and raising my charisma through items when possible. As a monk, can't really devote much to charisma or the appraise skill... unless I respec for just crafting... but probably not worth the extra effort and time it would take.